For years we've discussed the obvious link between the wave of illegals and the housing bubble. And we got slammed for it (by the PC crowd).
Well, like so many other issues where HP's been ahead of the crowd (as in every issue doesn't it seem?), this one is now out in the open for all to see.
The housing bubble drove illegal immigration (someone had to build all those damn houses). And illegal immigration drove the housing bubble (someone had to buy all those damn houses). And now the housing crash will drive the illegals back home (or deeper underground). And the illegals going away, and losing their jobs and ability to work, will speed up the housing crash. No matter what corrupt REIC idiots like Nicholas Retsinas want.
It's all linked HP'ers. And welcome to the truth America. Here's the story in the Washington Post, and a follow-up piece by HP'er Diana Olick at CNBC. Too bad the Arizona Republic, at the epicenter of illegal immigration and housing crash, is still asleep on this one. Even though the fake Arizona economy is about to implode along with its housing market.
Washington Post - Immigration, Housing Ills Seen as Linked
Prince William County's home prices and its Hispanic population rose in tandem during the first half of this decade, a result of a home-building frenzy that became a powerful magnet for immigrant laborers. They arrived by the thousands, sending housing values even higher.
Many did not come legally. But in the blur of swinging hammers and flying dollar signs, that detail was often overlooked. Illegal immigrants had little trouble finding jobs and not much trouble getting mortgages.
That arrangement has unraveled. Prince William has some of the highest foreclosure rates in the region, with a glut of unsold, depreciating homes. And its elected officials have embarked on one of the most ambitious efforts in the nation to drive out and deport illegal immigrants.
That combination -- an excess of housing and new anti-illegal immigrant policies -- is likely to exacerbate the county's weak real estate market, agents and lenders say. Regardless of one's views on immigration, they say, simple arithmetic dictates that if a lot of residents leave the county, the housing meltdown will only worsen.
October 06, 2007
Finally. The MSM finally links illegal immigration and the housing bubble and crash. HP's question - WHAT THE F*CK TOO SO LONG?
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Keith I need your assistance, I have not received a reply from anyone yet regarding my Phoenix AZ question, so can you please post this again. Thanks.
I would like to know if anyone can direct me to a specific location in Phoenix AZ where I can find rows and rows of abandoned or boarded up homes (aka - glut from housing bubble). I would also like to know if there are locations in Phoenix that have rows and rows of "for sale" signs.
My reason for this is that I will be doing a paper for school on housing and how it has become detached from economical fundamentals. I would like to take my own photos and interview some residents, if there are any left in these neighborhoods.
A side bar on how illegal immigration fueled the housing bubble as well won't hurt either.
I'm in NYC and it's amazing that so many in my class are still clueless. Yesterday I counted 6 "Mansions" for sale in and around Park - Lexington Avenues 63rd Street to 67th Street (Yes, I counted on my walk during free time in between classes)
Also Keith, you should do a post on the death of the Carol Ann Gothbaum at the Phoenix Airport. You see her town house in Manhattan had an open house the day of her flight and there is speculation that she became irrate at the airport after not being able to board her flight. It is believed that she was extremely angry at the prospect of not being able to conduct or be part of the open house. How desperate were they to sell? So in a nut shell, after predicting the rise in "fires" as a result of the housing ponzi scheme (fires in NYC have increased) HP should begin a post on deaths associated with the housing ponzi scheme.
Thanks Keith, keep up the great work. Feel free to shorten this post.
right. so once again its the immigrants fault. they come to work, buy a house, live the american dream, then they get duped by shady mortgage companies and real-estate brokers and get the scorn of the ever-so-wise keith. nice pic by the way. shows how EVERY illegal mexican feels. for sure.
Great post and links. You know, the other element to this story is the shoddy building practices that came out of the rush to build - so many houses going up with very unskilled and illegal labor. It doesn't take but a few lapses or the inability to communicate to create a house that isn't square,has crumbling foundations, with ill fitting windows, leaks, etc. I read an awful lot about f_cked homebuyers who are stuck in endless meaningless arbitration with national homebuilders... stuck with a declining asset that is a peice of sh_t to begin with.
Actually, I'd love to see you address this issue and your thoughts to how it will contribute to the bursting bubble. Thanks.
If the US deports those here illegally, why not deport those who commit most of the violent crime? Of course, I mean the blacks. Who else?
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Here we go again...blame the brown people because you can't afford a house.
Pathetic.
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....TOO SO LONG??????
What the Hell are we a Chinese menu now?
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Millions of illiterate, uneducated peons is good for the economy. That's why Mexico is in such good shape.
Hecho En Mexico
i bought a new house in So Calif ..
we have a slogan in So. Cal.
Hecho En Mexico.....Made in Mexico..that is the stamp we have on all the new housing in this nation... it is time that americans get back to work...
we need to bring back real jobs..
and stop selling each other expensive houses....that is the true definition of our so called SERVICE ECONOMY...
Here we go again. These Racist Mexican supremacists want everyone to remember "history" and make us believe California belongs to them. Well, okay, then, first things first.
NUMBER 1: Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo was signed by both countries, USA and Mexico, granting western territories to USA. Check your history books! Okay? Fair Enough? OH! What's that I hear? You say it was an unfair treaty. A treaty signed by duress? Okay then, so you believe California and the West should go to the people who were there first. Okay, then, point NUMBER TWO: GUESS what PUTO, these lands were first inhabited by the RED skins not the BROWN skins. DID you ever hear of The CHUMASH tribe? They had been living in Southern California for thousands of years, way before any racist Mexican supremacists set foot in California. The AZTECS inhabited a territory way down south, near present day Mexico City. So enough said, and quit harping about La Raza (the race): that sounds like Nazi crap, believing your race is better than other races. And yes, AZTLAN does exist: it is a shithole called TIJUANA.
BTW,
Are british still occupying Scotland and Ireland?
Yeppers!
And WTF is up with Canada and Australia? I mean are they like
British commonwealths?
It's not the Mexicans,or any other immigrant,it's the money grubbing dorks in Washington DC.I might have a couple of "beefs" with some Immigrants,but it's the US that wrecks every good thing about America.
Entitlements,Forced education,The central banking system,and Fractional reserve.The US requires ever expanding money transactions to keep the game going.
So millions of immigrants are needed to come ,and take part in the scheme.
The education level's controlled to make sure the masses don't get wise,and revert to common sense financial practices.
The MSM knew all along,but their checks are signed by big business.
now the housing crash will drive the illegals back home (or deeper underground). And the illegals going away, and losing their jobs and ability to work, will speed up the housing crash. No matter what corrupt REIC idiots like Nicholas Retsinas want
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Negative. SSI and Section 8 and Link Cards for all!!!
This guy holding the sign has got good point.
Does Ron Paul advocate that we leave Occupied Mexican territory?
Hey wait, doesn’t RP live on Occupied Mexican land?
Tell you all what, how bout we leave Iraq on the same day
That RP leaves occupied Mexico.
Or how bout we leave Iraq on the day Turkey and the Arabs leave
Occupied Kurdish land.
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Illegal raise Mexican flag over Maywood, CA
Why does this Mexican speak Spanish, is he a Spaniard?
Yeah we won and it's been our country for 150 years, so what do you not understand about illegal you uneducated putz??? Slavery was legal back in 1846 as well, so should we crank that up again too? Get some education you waste of sperm, and get the f*k out of OUR country you complaining jacka*ss.
I think the ‘international community’ does not like our foreign policy towards Mexico,
Wah wah wha … we really need the international community to like and respect us
Because?
Wait, the international community doesn’t like the colors on our flag, wah wa wha..
Lets change them right away; The UN will really like us if we make our Flag more
Neutral, how bout Yellow with Brown polka dots.
The *entire* California population
around 1950-1952 was around 10-million.
Now the Hispanic population in California *alone* is around 14-million.
With these numbers, they will have the voting power to put who they see will push their agenda in this country most rapidly - this is their plan.
Any by the way, the Indians were here long before the Hispanics - so they should put down those signs and walk right back across that border, where their own country can take responsibility for them.
Shame on our government for enacting laws which have entitled illegals with more priviledges (housing, healthcare, food) than for our own citizens.
Read todays market ticker blog,there is a link on this site,its great
What took so long? All those power lunches. Time spent gagging down oversized shrimp.
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Pachucco
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hi the mail lady back. as i said over a year ago most of the names of the foreclosed homes, and trust me I see thousands of pieces of mail not just a piece here and there (like the people in the public world) and the majority of names are of hispanic origin. Not a day goes by that dozens of foreclosure notices all go back on hispanic names. folks at the post office probably saw this problem years ago (2005 is years ago) but really didn't bother to connect the dots. anyone who looked at the construction knew there were nothing but mexican's and it was the mexican's who were buying the houses they were building. and then there were the speculators who would buy dozens of houses because they were watching those tv programs "real estate millionaires". Those are the people who fueled this problem not BLACK people like this site likes to make out, (if it's bad blame it on black people like Susan Smith everyone will believe they caused it even if there little or no proof just implying it is enough) all these rich people (white) who wanted cheap labor so they could keep more money in their pockets fueled the mexican's to come here in droves and undercut american unions, those are people who are to blame for this whole mess. Greedy WHITE people.
I am Democrat but am anti-illegal immigration. Instead of letting Mexicanos try to take over America, I want the Mexican people to take back their own country. I believe the U.S. should quit supporting illegal immigration and instead put "real" pressure on the corrupt government of Mexico to rebuild it's economy and empower its people. But that makes too much sense and I can dream on. And to add to the dreaming part, I also want Mexicans to extend the same generosities on their southern border as they expect us to extend on ours. They kill kids from Central and South America trying to cross into their country (literally throw them under trains). Lastly, I think it is funny that as a Democrat, the only time Bush ever aligns himself with the Democratic party, I am still in the opposite side than him. It makes me proud.
There are a shitload of illegals that are broke and homeless now that there are no 2x4's to throw around here in az.
I have heard of a few of them turning to prostitution to pay the bills. One was recently caugh nude in a phoenix burger king bathroom stall on his knees with a client.The poor POS is just trying to supplement his shitty income I guess.
There are illegals on every corner around here but nobody cares, cheap labor.
If anything we took it from the Indians NOT Mexicans
My gardener (legal) told me this last month. He said all his illegal friends have plans to head to the border for Xmas and not come back thanks to the new illegal law in AZ. I can't wait for the AZ market to crash. I'm not about to pay $250K to live in the slums in Phoenix. My $1K rental suites me just fine and the other $1K per month goes in the "bank."
This is why unemployment is so low. These folks are off the books. The sad thing is they were taken advantage of by the home builders who should have paid these folks prevailing wages and given them benefits. Now they have no job and nothing to show for all the work.
Builders, realty clerks and the whole gang sure were good at hiding the facts and robbing the store.
The housing/credit bubble was an illusion. This attracted the illegals to come to build the houses. The wealth, the job opportunities, GW's ownership society, all an illusion.
Its time for Americans to get back to reality.
Keith,
I've really enjoyed this blog. Not because I agree with everything you say or because I think you've got a brilliant financial mind, but because you've got the cojones to call bullshit when you think something stinks. But I think you have, to some extent, become the victim of your own success.
The housing bubble would have happened without illegal immigration, illegal immigration will continue without the housing bubble. The fact that illegal immigrants built or bought some homes during the boom means very little. Correlation, as they say, is not causation (hats [or goatees, for that matter] do not cause baldness).
Try hiding a team of illegal Uruguayan drywall workers in Vermont (which has also had a housing boom) and you'll see what I mean. There are a lot of reasons to take illegal immigration seriously and take a stance against it. Using the housing bubble/crisis/crash is easy, but it's cheap.
To get back to the opening statement, I think you've had to amp up your outrage progressively to maintain interest on this blog, which is a shame, because the core of what you started here is great. Also, I would agree with others' comments here that the gold-spruiking has gotten weird. It just makes it seem like the whole thing was frustration at not getting in at the start of the last bubble.
Mike F
keep voting dems everybody, they will get amnesty through eventually
Hasta la vista!
It's not the territory.
It's the country.
If the U.S. never "annexed" CA, NV, AZ, NM, CR, and UT ---- the United States of America would still be here. It would still be a world power. It would still have industry. People would still emigrate here. And Mexicans would still emigrate here because Mexico sucks.
Even if Mexico included California, Nevada, et al. -- it would still suck and people would still want to leave.
I have no sympathy for hordes of wave after wave of invading, culture of entitlement illegal criminal border crossers.
Let their homes go into foreclosure forcing them to leave.
Let the CDO's fail.
Let the builders who hired these illegals fail.
Let the banks lose the money they foolishly lent to illegals. I hope the homes they take back, rot with mold.
Let the investors take it in the shorts for losing their ass on multiple homes bought with IO loans.
Let the Toxic ARM's reset to double and triple for illegals with mortgages.
If this is the catalyst that forces you to go back to your country then so be it.
You broke our immigration laws getting here, now you are paying the consequences of being outlaws.
Please take your anchor babies on the way out.
Perhaps you will have learned a lesson that you can take back and make your own country a better place where you can stay for the rest of your life.
If you want to come to our country, next time, do it the right way.
"If anything we took it from the Indians NOT Mexicans"
you're assuming that the native americans were a cohesive group. there were probably groups all over the place and we called some mexicans and the others native americans.
it was estimated that over 40 million native americans lived in "north america" before columbus came and then all but 300,000 or so died because of "smallpox infested blankets," warfare and disease.
The Mexicans who imagine that California, Texas and New Mexico are "theirs" are delusionary.
BOTH recent owners of these territories were colonizers from Europe. Nobody is more right than the other. And between the two, the Americans were not as bad as the Spanish Monarchy. And both were less bloodthirsty and savage than the Aztecs.
Spanish is the language of Spanish and Catholic imperialism. English is the language of English and Protestant imperialism.
There are plenty of indigenous who got a wholly raw deal by the conquistadors. Spanish-speaking mexicans are the remnants of the conquerers, not the conquerees.
Indeed much of North and Central America was depopulated by European and Asian disease, long before smallpox blankets. Of course nobody in any part of this on any side knew anything about the scientific germ theory of disease.
And when they go back to mexico please take that god awful polka music with them and then just nuke the place just to be sure.
I live in Fauquier County (thankfully) which is the next county out from Prince William, and two counties from Fairfax. I would like to share a couple of things, having lived in Northern Virginia all my adult life:
1. I have no issues with Mexicans. Most of them are very hard working, pleasant and polite.
2. My issues are with OUR GOVERNMENT for allowing illegal immigration and/or turning a blind eye to it. THE MEXICANS WOULD NOT BE HERE IMPOSING ON OUR INFRASTRUCTURE (schools, hospitals, etc) IF WE HAD NOT ALLOWED IT. WHY ARE WE ALLOWING illegals to get a free education, free medical care, welfare, etc?? Why am I having to support these people???
3. Prince William County is a mess and would be whether or not the Mexicans were there. How the county commissioners could have allowed thousands upon thousands of homes to be built off of a TWO LANE ROAD (Route 15) leading up to the most congested highway in the Washington area (Route 66) is absolutely beyond comprehension. AND THEY ARE STILL BUILDING NEW HOMES AND TOWNHOUSES ALONG THIS ROAD!! Why would the governemnt allow this without roads in place to handle the traffic? Same goes for Bristow and Gainesville. A complete and utter mess Prince William is--grossly overbuilt with cookie-cutter houses. But don't blame the illegals--BLAME THE STUPID INCOMPETENT GOVERNMENT THAT ALLOWED IT TO HAPPEN!!!!!!!!!!
The reason they cannot fix thier country is because Mexican culture does not support civic organizations.
The best they can do is gangs - family type bonds - which are supported by thier culture.
Even the few big corporations in Mexico are managed basically like a huge gang.
Research Cementex if you do not believe me, biggest Mexican company, it's run like organizationally like a gang, that is why it works.
Why is it that when the illegals marched all over the American main capitals holding upside down American flags no American pussy complained, but when Keith displayed the American flag upside down here you all came out bitching like it was an outrage?
No answer needed...just keep spinning your hamster wheel and being bitches of Israel, China, Saudi Arabia, and Mexico...Giuliani wants you!
Mexico is a shithole and now those illegals come here and want to keep their shithole culture
I'm still looking for my neanderthal buddy to give it all back to, the rents gettin a bit high here,i'm just gonna crawl back into my cave, wake me up when this is all over.
The locations in PHX are Queen Creek, AZ. There is an article on Q Creek foreclosures on yahoo.com today (Saturday). Other locations are Surprise, Maricopa, and Buckeye to name a few. It has started in the exurbs and will work its way in to "posh" places like Scottsdale in about 3 years.
Are the French occupying the Ivory Coast? Yup.
Damn it! Damn it! Damn it!
If only Ben Brnanke didn’t lower the interest rates, none of this would have happened.
We would not have had a Brown people problem, housing market would have been a Ron Paul dream, average home prices would have dropped several hundred percent in 1 hour.
And the Dollar, Boy, the Dollar.
The Dollar would have been soo strong, a one-dollar bill could have split 2 cinder blocks with a single blow.
America needs to leave the "occupied Mexican territories" the day the Mexicans leave the "occupied native territories" in Mexico. Lead by example, illegal immigration apologists.
If you do a little research, you'll find that NAFTA lit the fires of illegal immigration from Mexico. Common Cause and other organizations predicted the problem would occur. That's NAFTA destroyed the small Mexican farmer's ability to make a living, and destroyed the small manufacturers.
Forget about maquiladoras. Cheap imports flooded into Mexico, small concerns went out of business, and left the countryside to find work in Mexican cities first, then US cities.
Before NAFTA was enacted, illegal immigration wasn't that big of a deal. NAFTA by the way was supported by big businesses, also organizations like the Sierra Club, and finally free trade politicians like Clinton, and I'm sure your holy Ron Paul.
I know this may sound harsh to some, but...
This country needs to pass statewide laws that prohibit bussiness from hiring illegal workers, and to deport anyone who doesnt have proper documents to be here.
I'm tired of of all the crime, and over burden of our health care system and jails by illegals...they have no business being here in the first place.
Send them all back, including their children to where they came from.
Did any of you stop to think that perhaps the illegal labor kept home prices from rising even higher? If you paid an alien $10 an hour versus hiring a union laborer at $30 an hour, you can guess how that might add to the price of a home.
Good letter on diana olick's blog. You gotta wonder how many illegals are just leaving the keys on the counter and walking away (back to Mexico)
Does a bankruptcy filing or bad credit report cross borders too? Don't think so... No social security number!
http://www.cnbc.com/id/21153325
Good article, but neither you or the Washington Post went all the way and connected all the dots. Neither of you addressed how we qualified these borrowers for these loans. These undocumented workers were the poster children for sub-prime loans. When you have multiple undocumented income sources in the household, limited assets, and needed to qualify the borrower, the only programs available were the no down, stated income, stated asset, room rent, or ninja high ltv loans, the same loans that some commentators on CNBC have called "sub-prime slime". Add to that the programs the some of the major banks ( Wells and BoA come to mind) rolled out with no SS# required, or stated income "second job" and you had markets dependent on "grey money".
Look at the states (CA, FL, TX, NV) with the highest foreclosure rates and numbers of 2 and 3 year sub prime resets then look at the numbers of undocumented workers in those states and the size of their underground economies. Not only were the illegals building the houses, they were buying them using "creative financing." Correlate that with the employment numbers in construction, which has dropped very little during this mess, and one might conclude that the undocumented workers were not only the first ones laid off but the first ones in financial trouble on their mortgages. Unfortunately for these borrowers, the programs that they used to buy their homes no longer exist, and nothing being proposed on the Federal level addresses the undocumented issue.
If you want to get an idea of the magnitude of this issue, you might want to talk to mortgage brokers in those states and find out how large a percentage of their business was dependent upon this market. I have had conversations with account execs (from sub prime lenders that no longer exist, coincidently) that said when the Patriot Act was passed and we had to start verifying SS numbers, they saw business drop as much as 80% from some accounts. I, for one, would really be interested in seeing hard numbers rather than listening to annecdotal evidence.
We should all be greatfull that Mexicans aren’t homicidal like Arabs.
Keefer,
There are 15 million illegals. That is 5% of the country. You are nuts if you think they are responsible for anything.
Might as well blame left handed people.
Mike F,
I agree with you up until the last sentence. I think most here would've been a lot happier had there *not been a housing bubble period. Regardless of cause.
It's absolutely true, we'd have had a bubble either way AND... either way we'd have considerable immagration issues. Given this article comes from the Washington Post (WaPo for MM fans) Michelle has got to be rolling on the floor!
DinOR
15 million illegals in the USA eh?
Uh, you ever go out and count them?
You're pretty confident with that 15 million number?
Wouldn't you be surprised if it was 100 million?
I wouldn't
You mean there was another illegal war of aggression by the United States in which territory was taken?
Have you ever heard of the essay "Civil Disobedience?" It was written in part due to that war.
PS -- The richest man in the world is a Mexican. And Cancun is not a shithole. I cannot beleive the level of ignorance that appears as soon as you mention Mexicans.
Can't wait for the illegals to self deport themselves. I have no sympathy whatsoever for people who have CHOSEN to break the laws of our country. I feel they deserve what they get as far as being taken advantage of by lenders and employers. I may sound a bit harsh, and I am really a very compassionate person, however it is EXTREMELY difficult to feel compassion for a group of CRIMINALS who DEMAND more rights than legal Americans receive. Our country will be JUST FINE without ILLEGALS. It is ignorant to think that there are jobs that can only be filled by illegal labor. Arizona made the right choice and will be handsomely rewarded in the near future. There are PLENTY of LEGAL Americans wanting to live in an enviroment where they do not feel helpless in the fight against the occupation of Mexico. People want to feel like they are in AMERICA not MEXICO. I absolutely commend Arizona for its efforts. Now if only other states would follow suit. As far as California and Washington are concerned, Mexico can have them if they don't first collapse into the Pacific. Nothing there but crazy liberals plotting the demise of the country anyway.
100 million illegals? dude are you high?
Anon said: "Did any of you stop to think that perhaps the illegal labor kept home prices from rising even higher? "
If houses were built by qualified union carpenters, houses would not have been marked to market.
It's because the illegal workforce is so inexpensive, the homebuilders made huge profits based on unskilled labor.
Lost Cause said...
PS -- The richest man in the world is a Mexican. And Cancun is not a shithole. I cannot beleive the level of ignorance that appears as soon as you mention Mexicans.
This subject makes everyone just like Dopes. Bring up Mexicans and we all get irrational as hell. So what if the richest man in the world is a Mexican. WTF??? Warren Buffet lives in Omaha, NB. What does that say about the U.S.? Nothing. It is irrelevant, and the service workers in Cancun in their tidy starched little uniforms leave the city every day and go home to mud huts with no running water or sewer. Mexico is a paradise? Next time you are in Cancun hop the bus to Chichen Itza and look out the window for 2 hours. Maybe Mr. Richie Rico should trickle down a little of that wealth to the masses. Then they would stop coming and stay home.
There are 15 million illegals. That is 5% of the country. You are nuts if you think they are responsible for anything.
Yeah, the millions of illegal immigrants have no effect on SoCal or Arizona or Texas. It's just a coincidence that all the hospitals are shutting down and schools are full of students who can't speak English.
Lost Idiot,
Cancun is a tourist resort and kept safe because of tourist dollars. How about the rest of Mexico? How about the 5 million people living in cardboard boxes around Mexico City? How about the hundreds of police officers murdered in Mexico each year?
If Mexico is the same as the USA, then why are millions of them trying to move to America compared to a few thousand Americans wanting to move there?
You leftwing dopes are dumber than the board troll DOPES. At least he has a little sarcasm and cynicism in his posts. You leftnuts are just purely stupid.
NAFTA by the way was supported by big businesses, also organizations like the Sierra Club, and finally free trade politicians like Clinton, and I'm sure your holy Ron Paul.
Once again, the idiotic trolls misrepresent Ron Paul. Dr Paul opposed NAFTA & WTO and said he would get rid of it. Keep voting for your idiotic Repugnants and DemoRats who continue to sell you out to the lowest bidder
Are the French occupying the Ivory Coast? Yup
You are not allowed to point out anything negative about Europeans because they are supposed to smarter and more civilized than Americans.
Illegals are horrible for this country, especially lower and middle class workers, the supposed backbone of the democtatic party. These people will undercut wages to the point that huge job classifications now go only to illegals - painters, carpenters, bricklayers, landscaping, etc. Seems like a great deal to the corporations profiting from this. The costs of these illegals, in the form of health care, education, crime, pollution, is spread out over everyone. So business profits at everyone else's expense. If business had to hire only legals, wages would be much higher, and the workers could pay for the services. The economy might be a little smaller, but it would be real.
didnt they steal that from the indians and aztecs......
Huff, I get so sick of this is Mexico crap.
First, how long was CA in Mexico for ? Just a couple decades. Next, they got CA after the Spanish lost Mexico -- CA just landed in their laps. How long has CA been in the US? What more that 150 years?
To this day, there are massive rivalries between native Americans. Some Casinos in CA don't even trust or support each other. Particularly, when a casino is built on a reservation that is in the middle of no where. Back in the old west some tribes would just align differently.
Then they don't mention that indians use to scalp English speaking people. Moreover, take those English people hostage and sell them to the French for guns, booz and supplies. So much for all this innocent crap. Or that New Amsterdam ( Manhattan ) was sold to the dutch for guns and booz by the indians. Of course, the indians might have not had a concept of land ownership and thought they were ripping off the Dutch.
Another issue from the Washington perspective is the west has always been viewed as a colony. After the civil war, parcels of land were donated out to civil war veterans. Most of this land was in the middle of no where CA at the time. So, these vets cashed in their land. So, you had these huge ranches develop. eg, Irvine etc. Yep, even back then, there were Mexicans on those ranches who would call Irvine "el Patron". Irvine might fly in once a year and did not give a crap about the land. So, this sets the stage for the entire developer mentality. Huge tracks of land that get sold off. They never cared about the land. Of course, the people who bought those homes now do.
When you dig deeper things are a little more complex.
I live in Prince William County Va and I won't link race to problems, but to me, a vet, it's crazy that No doc loans, ein's etc were given to people who have no legal right as a citizen in the first place buying homes to live in, 1 in most cases they broke the law by crossing the border, 2 by using fake social security numbers to get jobs and (things that if you are a citizen and do you will face imprisonment if caught) and property all of which should be confiscated, The other unfair phenomenon is have 2 or 3 families living in one house after they have illegally secured it...taking up numerous visitor parking and other parking with work vans, using the HOV and pushing out long time legal contractors and driving them out of business because they will work for low wages and in many case perform sub par jack leg work, unlike some places the hispanics came almost overnight in the thousands....and to those making the whole mexican argument in that sign, the majority of the immigrants arent even Mexican, they are second class in the eyes of the Mexicans and they are rejected they just happened to have to cross through Mexico to get here.....The U.S. in it's inaction has endorsed and encouraged illegal immigration, it is completely unfair to other countries that do not share a border with the U.S. that have people that would like to be legal citizens.
Oh I'm sorry I didn't realize I was at a KKK rally. What happened to the housing blog?
Shagging ass across the border like a frigging jackrabbit isn't immigration. It's a damn crime! There are millions waiting to enter this country through legal channels. Who speaks for them? Deport every single illegal regardless of country of origin.
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