February 18, 2008

Debt is not wealth. There. Got it. Any questions?


I know fakes that have invaded Scottsdale, Vegas, Miami, LA and other poser towns are confused by the above statement, but this little cleansing underway should help them come to understand.

Houses "bought" with toxic loans. Cars leased and not owned. Spending fueled by credit cards and not income. It was all fake. Just like the people.

And now it's getting real.


This should get more and more interesting as it all unwinds, right here for everyone to see. Let's hope people learn a valuable life lesson out of this mess.



38 comments:

Anonymous said...

BUT I WANT IT NOW!! AND THE TV SAYS I CAN HAVE IT NOW!!

Ed said...

Yo, dat ride iz da shizznit to da wizznit, kno what I'm sayin?

Anonymous said...

wait, renting houses is good but leasing depreciated vehicles is bad?

Anonymous said...

Being leveraged to the teeth sucks during a downturn

keith said...

Paying interest on houses or cars is for suckers

That's the point

Debt = Slavery

Anonymous said...

Let's hope people learn a valuable life lesson out of this mess

Ya, Bail me OUT

Anonymous said...

You link to the socialist worker website?

Very telling.

Boom2Bust.com said...

"Let's hope people learn a valuable life lesson out of this mess."

Others will take their place. They always do...

Anonymous said...

Ehhh... i dunno about the cars, i got one with only a $1000 down and at 1.9%....even if i had the cash to buy it i dont think i would have forked it all over.

Anonymous said...

It's PoserPANIC now!

keith said...

I stand corrected on cars.

If you can negotiate your rock-bottom price on a car (no strings) AND get the dealer to give you 0% or 1.1% financing (or anything lower than what a savings account pays) then take the financing and invest what you would have paid cash. You're better off with that math.

Veronica Lodge said...

RE: Debt is not wealth.

How appropriate that this topic should come up this very Monday morning.

One of the first things I do every Monday morning go HERE and read what Jim Kunstler has to say about the unfolding global economic tragedy which will soon reveal itself to one and all.

In regard to Citigroup's halting redemptions for its $500-million CSO mini hedge fund, Mr. Kunstler says:

"What the big banks who run many hedge funds are doing is going broke. They are pretending to be solvent by borrowing money from the Federal Reserve, the nation's alleged superbank. But borrowed money is not capital, i.e. surplus wealth wholly owned. Borrowed money is an obligation, a liability, a negative on the balance sheet. You can't have an entire financial system based on nothing more than a giant daisy-chain of liabilities. Somewhere there has to be a "reserve" of assets, items of value owned by somebody."

"(Banks) are pretending to have money and desperately cadging loans from all comers to keep appearances up, but the loans can't come in fast enough. The appearance of confidence is crucial (as it is, of course, in any "con" game) to keep the investors (depositors) at bay."

And once a bank's depositors lose confidence, the inevitable run on this bank will occur as depositors line up in an attempt to take out all of their money before it is too late.

Today's Clusterfu*k Nation column is well worth reading.

V.L.

Mark in San Diego said...

Nice reflective article on AP-Yahoo news this morning:

http://tinyurl.com/2lqbyu

Consumer Unease - some great quotes - "inflation adjusted, wages have not gone up since 1973," people have been making up by sending the wife out to work, credit cards, and borrowing on their house - "Jobs are plentiful, but pay little". . . .

Mark - pretty much what I have been saying - we have been in a "depression disguised as prosperity for 20 years". . .bubble to bubble, but the working class has been screwed while the top 20% have done well.

I have had a front row seat for this - my dad was a steelworker in Ohio, and I made good and joined the top 20%, but my old friends back in Canton, OH have been screwed. . .most now work two jobs, will never retire, and have a lot of health problems because they have poor healthcare, etc. Not a pretty picture.

Anonymous said...

>> Yo, dat ride iz da shizznit to da wizznit, kno what I'm sayin?

No. Speak English you stupid fuck!

NM Real Estate said...

That cannot be more true; keeping up with the Joneses has become a way of life in the USA with serious consequences.

Anonymous said...

Vanilla Joe looks Ghetto fab! I know who he's voting for.

Anonymous said...

.

I Want It all,

and I want IT NOW!

.

Anonymous said...

.

It is interesting,

I can mortgage a house I can't afford, buy way to much vehicle, bling....and on and on,

And I would be considered rich.

Vanity of Vanities,

all is Vanity.

cobra2411 said...

I don't think the debt is wealth has been totally answered yet. If there is a government bailout then debt does equal wealth...

Frank@Scottsdale-Sucks.com said...

"wait, renting houses is good but leasing depreciated vehicles is bad?"

You're obviously not a business owner. I paid cash for my last car which was S-T-U-P-I-D because the deduction is only $15,000 over three years, max. I leased my current car under my business and now I get to deduct 100% of the cost. I did a pre-paid lease so I paid it in one lump sum, without monthly interest payments.

This idea of "only buy a car for cash, no lease" is fine if you have a job but downright dumb for a business owner.

Anyway, back on topic - what's bizarre about Scottsdale is a lot of these debt-ridden phonies actually seem to believe they're rich. I guess it's the phenomenon of people believing their own lies after they lie long and hard enough.

AmazingRuss said...

"If you can negotiate your rock-bottom price on a car (no strings) AND get the dealer to give you 0% or 1.1% financing (or anything lower than what a savings account pays) then take the financing and invest what you would have paid cash. You're better off with that math."

Don't forget to add the cost of full coverage insurance into that math. The only car I ever financed ended up costing more monthly in insurance than the payment. (It was an overpowered phallic symbol on wheels, but STILL)

My current disreputable looking beater costs me $28/month for liability AND if I decide I want to take it off road, or airborne, no worries. I could replace it for less than what is in my checking account.

Saw a filthy Hummer with bald tires in the costco parking lot yesterday. Full of blankets and trash...I wonder if somebody was living in it. After a few dozen $100 fillups, it has to start hurting.

eric in vegas said...

Please don't take my H2! My girl will leave me!

Anonymous said...

Historical foreclosure rate is ~0.5% of all houses. Now it's up to 1-1.5% or so. Overall, we're still only looking at a very small proportion of the popluation. Yeah, it's fun to laugh at the Mr. leased Hummer types. But they only represent 1/100 people if not less. Hardly sounds like anything to get all worked up over.

Anonymous said...

Once again, stories like this remind me to say THANK YOU Keith and loyal HP readers/bloggers!!

Thanks to being exposed to the wisdom and advanced warning I got on this site, I got off my A$$, paid my credit cards and car over the last year and began stashing as much cash as I could in the bank.

With such an insecure economic future ahead, I am feeling at least a little better--I can live on a Hooters waitress salary now if I had to! LOL

MUCHAS FREAKIN GRACIAS to all and best of luck in the storm ahead!

WINGS said...

I find it simply delightful that I can go into a bank, sit down, munch on some chips, and observe the $30K millionaire phonies screaming and crying that they should get to keep their toys because they deserve them.

In the background you can hear me cackling!

Woman: I want my Hummer back!

Banker: No, we've taken it from you. You're all tapped out of home equity on a home that is twice the value, now, of your mortgage.

Wings: Crunch, crunch, cackle, cackle...

Bwahahaha!

Who needs the movies when this spectator sport is sooo much funner!

Yay!

You've made me so very happy with your shenanigans. If I'm going to have to foot the bill as a taxpayer, I'm sure as hell am going to enjoy the show!

Anonymous said...

The problem with people like you Keith and Frank at Scottsdale Sucks is that you guys are really jealous of people who do possess wealth. You folks and your many minions on this board seem to think anyone who is wealthy is "fake". I have news for you: this economy will not falter, it will not fail, it won't collapse. This country is the greatest nation in history. This too shall pass.

Anonymous said...

Too many people believing that if you can drive a shiny Yukon with shiny rims than you have made it. Pie in the sky baby. Who cares if it costs you 40% of your construction worker/field laborer/etc. wages.

Jeez, I chose to drive a small hyundai. why would you want to waste your hard earned income on extra gas and a depreciating asset. I'll never understand the car-ego connection.

Anonymous said...

Damn! I'm really gonna miss those H2's emblazoned with Got Realtor? etc and or Mortgage broker website address graphics and a stupid personalized licsense plate with something like "1MTGBRKR" rolling around SoCal with some fake ass made up made up bitch or some pompous ass businessman realtor GOON yaking away on there crackberries.

K Campbell said...

its the world of today.....

Russ DoGG said...

Veronica Lodge - thanks for the link- that's good reding (kuntsler)

Russ DoGG said...

I don't think Mr Bling confuses debt with wealth. He bought that ugly hummer as an investment in getting some "trim".

Lighten up already. You can't blame a guy for borrowing money to try and get a car that will attract a little female companionship.

Anonymous said...

It will be a great day in America when the Hummer brand goes the way of Oldsmobile and is phased out for lack of generating income. The H1 was about serious offroading and could not be used as a daily driver.

The H2 and H3 represent everything wrong with our nation; vanity, stupidity, debt, phoney front, egomania, mental disease, etc...

I'm just glad fuel will be too expensive for these POS trucks to get into the hands of high school kids 5-10 years from now when they depricate to under $5000. Junk GM product, immature driver, lack of proper care, and a heavy weight = killing machine. Um...not to discount the dumba**es who drive them these days.

Frank@Scottsdale-Sucks.com said...

"The problem with people like you Keith and Frank at Scottsdale Sucks is that you guys are really jealous of people who do possess wealth."

Actually, no, I respect and celebrate legitimate wealth that is honestly earned.

Are you even aware of the fact that I left Scottsdale to move to 92657, the wealthiest zip code in America?

I *LOVE* real wealth. I *HATE* fake money.

PS: There's no real wealth in Scottsdale. Get a clue and stop drinking the Kool-Aid.

Frank@Scottsdale-Sucks.com said...

Anon 2:06, since the argument that "Frank is just jealous of Scottsdale" annoys the crap out of me, I looked up the demographics for where I now live:

Average individual income: $388,600
Average home price: $1.8 million
58% of homes are owned outright with no mortgage
Median age: 38

Here's the link if you think I'm lying:
http://tinyurl.com/ynknvp

Dude, stop trying to tell me I'm jealous of Scottsdale (where the avg individual income is $39k) because it just makes you look like a dumbass to say something that ignorant.

Ed said...

"Anonymous said...

>> Yo, dat ride iz da shizznit to da wizznit, kno what I'm sayin?

No. Speak English you stupid fuck!

February 18, 2008 4:26 PM"

Dude, lay off the tripple espresso today. Geezus fucking christ, lighten up.

area 51 said...

To ed:

Hells ya dawg, I feel ya'.....

Anonymous said...


Historical foreclosure rate is ~0.5% of all houses. Now it's up to 1-1.5% or so. Overall, we're still only looking at a very small proportion of the popluation.


You're an idiot and a dope. Even the prime default rate is at 4.5% now. The subprime at CountryWide is almost 20%

Add those numbers up year over year for 3 years and you have a disaster.

Anonymous said...

Debt can be an absolute nightmare when it starts to spiral Out of control. It best to get some debt consolidation advice if it starts to affect your health through the stress of it all. Then when your finally out of debt try and make sure it does'nt happen again!