tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post4371516074854544374..comments2024-01-15T12:16:41.302+00:00Comments on HousingPANIC - The Housing Bubble Blog with an Attitude Problem, 2005 - 2008: So, how's that "Ownership Society" working out for America now Mr. Bush?bloggerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06585266242070350399noreply@blogger.comBlogger64125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-70501914653891702032008-04-01T00:10:00.000+01:002008-04-01T00:10:00.000+01:00* The banks are failing-- No banks are not failing...* The banks are failing<BR/>-- No banks are not failing only some greedy ones are in trouble.<BR/>* Millions of Americans have been financially destroyed<BR/>-- Only some stupid ones have been punished and number is not that high. By the way such people will be punished no matter what.<BR/>* The last suckers in - women and minorities - got hurt the worst after being encouraged to buy at the top regardless of price<BR/>-- No comment<BR/>* Trillions have been lost with trillions more to go<BR/>-- Sure.<BR/>* Hundreds of thousands have lost their jobs<BR/>-- Not exactly unless you count all the realty jobs created to get the suckers in.<BR/>* Neighborhoods are filling up with foreclosures and falling into decay<BR/>-- No comments<BR/>* The world financial system is collapsing<BR/>-- well not so but panic is there.<BR/>* America is in recession<BR/>-- Recession happens and it happens because of multitudes or reasons.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-80032754877004512402008-04-01T00:09:00.000+01:002008-04-01T00:09:00.000+01:00Watch out!! They're coming to get you!! In black h...<I>Watch out!! They're coming to get you!! In black helicopters!!</I><BR/><BR/><BR/>Haw haw haw "tinfoil hat" haw haw haw!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-76970119202658282522008-03-31T22:08:00.000+01:002008-03-31T22:08:00.000+01:00"Ahem. Have you forgotten the nine Republicans in ..."Ahem. Have you forgotten the nine Republicans in Black robes who appointed Bush II Pretzldent back in 2000??<BR/><BR/>Or that Diebold was the one counting the ballots in 2004??"<BR/><BR/>Watch out!! They're coming to get you!! In black helicopters!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-23371759900066510932008-03-31T20:53:00.000+01:002008-03-31T20:53:00.000+01:00To Anonymous 1:49am, 3/31The "unassailable data" t...To Anonymous 1:49am, 3/31<BR/><BR/>The "unassailable data" to which you refer was TRUTHFUL data. The lower percentage of home ownership and the higher interest rates charged to minorities were a reflection of their higher credit risks; not because of their skin color.<BR/><BR/>In fact, the lending regulations in place at the time PROTECTED them from taking out loans that they simply could not pay back. Unfortunately, the pounding the banks and politicians took from ACORN and the hundreds of other liberal orgs (the “yearly report”) finally wore everyone down and they invented subprime since they had the opportunity to do so with such low interest rates. They could get people into houses and then those folks could refinance to a lower rate when the interest rate reset…with the assumption that housing will always go up. So that was the model; that was the way to get poor minorities into home ownership...and ACORN and all the rest of the lib orgs approved of it.<BR/><BR/>Did a lot of bad and venal things happen along the way...yes indeed; no argument there. Once the lenders got subprime, alt-a's (for the ILLEGALS...again, to placate you liberals), and option arms, they went hog wild and sold them to everyone, regardless of race, creed, income, etc. Yes, they went for the fees...since that is the new model for lenders and bankers, not holding the mortgages. But they did it to all races, not just blacks and hispanics; whites are getting screwed too, and in larger absolute numbers.<BR/><BR/>I will keep repeating it: THE LIBERAL ACTIVISTS AND HOUSING ORGS PRESSURED BANKS AND POLITICIANS INTO CREATING TOXIC LOANS. THAT WAS THE BEGINNING OF IT...AND YES, IT SNOWBALLED FROM THERE. <BR/><BR/>Don’t you libs go running around as if you are blameless. You are not. You are just as guilty as the rest of the folks you (and I) blame for this mess.<BR/><BR/>So you have learned an important lesson. and that is: you know nothing about finance or the financial system, and therefore you should just shut up or you will end up contributing to a future debacle.<BR/><BR/>by the way, did it ever occur to you that prior to this mess, if banks thought they could make a buck on someone they would do so by lending them money? There is absolutely no reason for a bank not to lend money to someone who is a good credit risk. You say there is however: because banks are racist. I think you are completely out of your mind. If there's money to be made, then companies will do what they can to make it. I mean, if banks and lenders were so racist, then why is it that they started making all these loans to minorities recently? did the entire industry have a change of heart in a nano-second and say "we don't want to be racist anymore?" Of course not. they started making loans because interest rates were so low and they could create mortgages that they could then actually sell to minorities who were poor credit risks…loans that they could not have created before (due to legitimate regulations regarding high risk people) and which was the only way to get people who were poor credit risks into houses.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, you libs have a lot of explaining to do and a lot of mea culpas to make. And again, you should just shut the hell up going forward since you know nothing about finance or financial systems, unlike myself who actually has a master's degree in this field.<BR/><BR/>And once more, if banks were so racist in the past, why did they start lending tons of money to minorities starting in 2002? If they were true racists, they wouldn't have lent them anything. Oh, was it because they said "let's really screw the minorities by lending money to them when we know they can't repay, which will mean they will default and then we'll end up with their home when we foreclose on it"?....gee whiz, gimme a break!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-19038257281566871062008-03-31T11:38:00.000+01:002008-03-31T11:38:00.000+01:00Make up your mind Keith. Is it Bush's fault? NAR? ...Make up your mind Keith. Is it Bush's fault? NAR? Greenspan? Bernanke? FBs? Countrywide?<BR/><BR/>Every day there is a new villain.Edhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13750286862065420283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-48546796929053803852008-03-31T05:56:00.000+01:002008-03-31T05:56:00.000+01:00Anonymous Democraatus said... The American Vot...Anonymous Democraatus said...<BR/> The American Voter 2000/2004 - the Worst and Most Dumbest voter in the History of the United States.<BR/><BR/> There is no better argument against democracy and/or general voting rights.<BR/>===================================<BR/>Ahem. Have you forgotten the nine Republicans in Black robes who appointed Bush II Pretzldent back in 2000??<BR/><BR/>Or that Diebold was the one counting the ballots in 2004??Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-19736090559387585162008-03-31T02:09:00.000+01:002008-03-31T02:09:00.000+01:00"It is time for you to just face this fact: libera..."It is time for you to just face this fact: liberal groups and liberal housing activists are just as much to blame for this problem as the greedy bankers, lenders, buyers, and moronic govt. policy makers."<BR/><BR/>Can this be construed to mean the Bush administration has fallen victim to liberal activistism in its efforts to prevent/resolve this problem?<BR/><BR/>Or, is this just another lame attempt to blame the liberals (Clinton did it!) for the abysmal failures of this greedy, moronic administration??Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-71764560370926685022008-03-31T01:49:00.000+01:002008-03-31T01:49:00.000+01:00The one area where NO blame has yet been given to ...<I>The one area where NO blame has yet been given to are the housing activist groups and other liberal orgs that put out those surveys every year saying that poor minorities were unjustly getting the shaft by being charged higher interest rates or not getting loans at all. If you don't remember those reports then you simply are not an aware American. You couldn't miss them since they came out like clockwork every goddamn year for decades...that is, until the early 2000s, at which point they stopped since subprime, alt-a, and option arms were getting minorities into homes.</I><BR/><BR/>Gee, so did anything change?<BR/><BR/>Looks like the CONS managed to weasel out of more honest lending by shafting poor and minorities ONCE AGAIN! Oh, they certainly didn't mind shafting other people too---so I guess their greed isn't quite so blatantly racist as it could have been. <BR/><BR/>Yes, in many cases, they were sold subprime---high fee, toxic loans---even when they could qualify for better (for the debtor, worse for the lender) terms. And yes, more than whites.<BR/><BR/>This wasn't liberals fault---this was greedy conservative capitalists perverting, for a profit, the pressure that was deservedly placed them thanks to decades of unassailable statistical evidence. <BR/><BR/>FHA is a liberal program. It is full doc and comparatively conservative. And it hasn't blown up like Countryfried.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-2153358776631137432008-03-31T00:45:00.000+01:002008-03-31T00:45:00.000+01:00"Its just so obvious that the corporations spent 3..."Its just so obvious that the corporations spent 300 million in lobbying efforts for de-regulation because they were sooo anxious to help those poor and working class people"<BR/><BR/>No they were not; nor were the authors of the original regulations to begin with. All those regulations were written up by bankers decades ago. Every time there's new rules to be made, the parasites want their servings at the table first.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-62569810195682988172008-03-31T00:24:00.000+01:002008-03-31T00:24:00.000+01:00Reagan started the socialization of company losses...Reagan started the socialization of company losses, privatize their profits, and team Bus finished it. I can't wait for all the bush bots to get cornholed buy the men they elected. It will be glorious.<BR/><BR/>Talk about irony. But but, mommie said they were conservatives. ROTFLMAO, the bush built scheitt sandwich commeth, you have been given notice.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-21413644142866684832008-03-30T23:23:00.000+01:002008-03-30T23:23:00.000+01:00McCain guru linked to subprime crisis:"$300 millio...McCain guru linked to subprime crisis:<BR/><BR/>"$300 million lobbying effort that drove deregulation"<BR/><BR/>Oh my, I was sooo wrong. Its just so obvious that the corporations spent 300 million in lobbying efforts for de-regulation because they were sooo anxious to help those poor and working class people<BR/><BR/>http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9246.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-73129865997271536592008-03-30T22:56:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:56:00.000+01:00"Government intervention in the form of crony capi..."Government intervention in the form of crony capitalism (no bid contracts, deregulation, corporate welfare, etc.)is a major source of ABUSE of power."<BR/><BR/>The ultmate expression of that are:<BR/>(1) government monopoly on the currency, fiat money;<BR/><BR/>(2) government monopoly determination on short-term interest rate without any bidding process;<BR/><BR/>(3) government underwriting of mortgages through FHA, FNM, FRE, etc.<BR/><BR/>(4) government tax preferential treatment of capital gain on housing: getting in the way of normal healthy competition for capital.<BR/><BR/>Deregulation per se is not the problem; the problem is the left-over regulations that have not yet be demolished just have their power amplified and hence become more corrupt. For example, the deregulation of Glass-Steegal served to increase competition among financial institutions . . . yet the left-over regulation on what can be counted as "money" and what the short-term interest rate is makes the financial market all the more dependent on FED interest rate policies. That's where the abuse came from.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-55054572353957662842008-03-30T22:48:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:48:00.000+01:00wc,What do you think the 250k single /500k joint d...wc,<BR/><BR/>What do you think the 250k single /500k joint deduction is? What the artificially low interest rate is? What Fannie/Freddie are?<BR/><BR/>They are all products of regulations! And you want more regulations? Whenever there are regulations, the regulations only serve to distort the market place: what are the chances of regulators getting in the way of "helping the working class owning homes"? All three distortions that you mentioned and I quoted above were supposed to help the low-income family own homes! At the top of the market, the top regulator even went on record, during congressional hearings, praising the banks for "creative financial engineering"! <BR/><BR/>Too bad God is not applying for jobs; all we get for regulators are dumbhucks who don't see a bubble even as the bubble squash them like bugs. If the bureacrats had half a clue about market timing, they'd be hiring themselves out to investment bankers and making seven-digit salaries intead of those low-six-digit regulator jobs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-44160533692393205132008-03-30T22:40:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:40:00.000+01:00"You are the one not hearing: when the government ..."You are the one not hearing: when the government is powerful, who do you think have the money to co-opt it and get to pull the levers of that powerful government machine? Of course, the wealthy individuals, not the poor. Corporation is just an artificial entity put together by a bunch of individuals, under the government law, in pursuit of profit with limited liability. Enpowering the government is as simple as giving the poor and the middle class a rope to hang themselves."<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>Now, you are arguing a different matter. One I won’t say is without merit but is essentially naive. There will always be government so the essential question is by and for whom. In a democracy it ideally works out that it’s for the greater whole vs. other forms of government such as this pseudo democracy we have which is somewhere verging on corporate fascism and is for the very few. Your argument is similar to those that argue for a free-market when there never has been in the history of the world such a thing and is no more possible in reality than working communism or unicorns for that matter. Some one will always have their finger on the scale in a market. The market is only an economic tool. The essential question is again for what or whom is the tool used? Those that argue for unregulated free-markets are often unwittingly arguing for markets that only benefit the few and most powerful as we have now. “Free markets” are only a means/tool for privatizing the gains into the hands of the few and socializing their losses on to the greater society. Who is it by and for is the first and most important question.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-13094249860621525442008-03-30T22:22:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:22:00.000+01:00I hear once Obama gets in her will buy everyone a ...I hear once Obama gets in her will buy everyone a new house, free and clear.<BR/><BR/>Do you call the above proper grammar, Ed? Talk about irony!<BR/><BR/>Ed is the most discredit and dumbest poster on HP.<BR/><BR/>--------------------------------- <BR/><BR/><BR/>Ed is wise. Bud-wise.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-21216743459606206912008-03-30T22:16:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:16:00.000+01:00You liberals who continue to deny your party's rol...You liberals who continue to deny your party's role and your housing activists' role in this debacle are simply acting like the fucked homebuyers out there who don't think there's a housing crash.<BR/><BR/>The fact of the matter is that organizations like ACORN, and hundreds of similar liberal activist organizations, are up to the eyeballs in responsibility for this problem, just like the banks, lenders, and buyers are. <BR/><BR/>You simply can't refute the FACT that year after year after year after year your crazy groups shamed banks into creating subprime loans that were targeted for poor minorities in the beginning. And yes, like profit driven companies do, the lenders and bankers then said, "Hey, we can peddle subprime to everyone!"...and so they did. And yes, their greed and fraudulent/criminal practices made this situation of catastrophic proportions. And then once they were done wringing out everyone with subprime, they invented alt-a's and option arms to get even worse people into homes, or wealthy people into them that were banking on huge leverage making them rich in an "always rising housing market". Yes, I agree with that. But plenty of poor people took out these loans too...many of which were minorities and ILLEGAL ALIENS who could not document their incomes since they were getting paid under the table. Yes, the same ILLEGAL ALIENS that you want to grant citizenship to. Yes, the 20 million ILLEGAL ALIENS, many of which who own homes bought with alt-a's and options arms...no documentation required. Another idiotic scheme promoted by your liberal activist organizations and grabbed onto by greedy bankers.<BR/><BR/>PLEASE don't sit there and yap about how your liberal activist groups had nothing to do with this humongous problem. For those on this site who have read my posts, I assign blame all around...it goes everywhere. The one area where NO blame has yet been given to are the housing activist groups and other liberal orgs that put out those surveys every year saying that poor minorities were unjustly getting the shaft by being charged higher interest rates or not getting loans at all. If you don't remember those reports then you simply are not an aware American. You couldn't miss them since they came out like clockwork every goddamn year for decades...that is, until the early 2000s, at which point they stopped since subprime, alt-a, and option arms were getting minorities into homes.<BR/><BR/>Bush's idea of an ownership society is laudable, actually. There's nothing wrong with home ownership - even ACORN believes that! No limousine liberal in wealthy suburbs on the Coasts would disagree with that. The problem with it, unfortunately, is that not everyone can own a home, which we have just found out...the hard way...and so did you stupid liberals. But somehow, I know you will twist and turn the facts of history, as you usually do, to fit your narrow view of the world so that you don't have to take any of the blame for your idiotic beliefs, activism, and policies. And you will go on to harp, complain, whine, yell, and scream bloody murder for the rest of your lives since, when you get down to it, that's all you really like to do. It makes you feel like you're doing something good.<BR/><BR/>It is time for you to just face this fact: liberal groups and liberal housing activists are just as much to blame for this problem as the greedy bankers, lenders, buyers, and moronic govt. policy makers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-44632005256036373452008-03-30T22:09:00.000+01:002008-03-30T22:09:00.000+01:00"Power brings out the worst in people; government ..."Power brings out the worst in people; government intervention in the market place is a major source of power."<BR/><BR/>Government intervention in the form of crony capitalism (no bid contracts, deregulation, corporate welfare, etc.)is a major source of ABUSE of power.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-54962853591388698912008-03-30T21:43:00.000+01:002008-03-30T21:43:00.000+01:00MONKEYMONKEYAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-2307661780768210902008-03-30T21:38:00.000+01:002008-03-30T21:38:00.000+01:00Liberals would rather have a leader like Chavez or...Liberals would rather have a leader like Chavez or Stalin. Do what they say or risk being killed. Much better than Bush.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-29990539412914135692008-03-30T20:49:00.000+01:002008-03-30T20:49:00.000+01:00I figured, they might be tough on the economy, but...<I>I figured, they might be tough on the economy, but not this bad. WE WERE ALL FOOLED!</I><BR/><BR/>I wasn't. I saw those 2 and the evil GOP for what they really are, a bunch of warmonger profiteers. Never voted for them and never will.<BR/><BR/>The next biggest lie will be Obama. I won't vote for him because I see an Empty Suit that's fooling the usual sheeple who should never pick a president.<BR/><BR/>Kiss your capital gains tax cut goodbye as Obama will give it all to Africa in foreign aid. Remember his only bill in the Senate? $1 trillion of American tax money in foreign aid to Africa. Does anyone care to doubt that this money won't reach the intended market? Lot's of secret society fronts disguised as charitable organizations out there.<BR/><BR/>Most people have no idea how they'll lose their retirement money, currently invested in Mutual Funds, when Obama erases the capital gains tax break. Oh, and he said in a speech that he'll do it.<BR/><BR/>You see, every time the turnover is high in your mutual fund, the financial institution has to pay capital gains on the profits to the government, which now has a lower tax rate. After Obama erases it, as he said he would, your egg's nest will drop considerably overtime. It could be the difference between retiring with $2 million dollars or with just $200k.<BR/><BR/>Those are the details that the ignorant sheep doesn't pay attention to or understand. Hillary won't erase the capital gains tax break. Enjoy your retirement in poverty by voting for Obama.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-84001854739376609002008-03-30T20:44:00.000+01:002008-03-30T20:44:00.000+01:00What is the infatuation with gays and marijuana on...What is the infatuation with gays and marijuana on this board? Somehow every blog entry turns into a pro-gay or pro-marijuana rant<BR/><BR/>--------------<BR/><BR/>Aqui aye mucho maricon liberal. Aye tanto maricon que este blog se llama <BR/>Los Maricones Que no Pudieron Compra Casa.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-21904556113763161672008-03-30T20:31:00.000+01:002008-03-30T20:31:00.000+01:00I hear once Obama gets in her will buy everyone a ...<I>I hear once Obama gets in her will buy everyone a new house, free and clear.</I><BR/><BR/>Do you call the above proper grammar, Ed? Talk about irony!<BR/><BR/>Ed is the most discredit and dumbest poster on HP.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-16425451026401130202008-03-30T19:48:00.000+01:002008-03-30T19:48:00.000+01:00Dear "I've had it"...Don't you think the fact that...Dear "I've had it"...Don't you think the fact that there is a 250K single/500K joint deduction on the sale of a primary residence, or the fact that credit was kept artifically low for such an extended period of time or the fact that lending institutions can immediately turn around and resell their bad loans without any government oversight to government-backed groups like Fannie/Freddie had a little more to do with it than those "effing" liberals? It's lack of regulation that created this mess and you can very well blame Bush and his ownership-society cronies for that and I wouldn't exactly call them liberals. There is nothing more Christian than helping out your fellow man and I can't think of a single thing Bush has done for the "people" he's supposed to represent unless they have been in the top 10% of the wealthiest Americans. Our planet is being destroyed by these corrupt politicians that would rather let the ocean be polluted with oil spills and PVC from all of the plastic and teflon we've discarded than to put regulations into place that might be inconvenient to their corporate donors - even if what they do endangers your drinking water, your food chain and the very air you breathe.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-43621194174249222242008-03-30T19:45:00.000+01:002008-03-30T19:45:00.000+01:00"Countrywide etc did it for enormous fat fees from..."Countrywide etc did it for enormous fat fees from securitization. There was no public service motivation or pressure whatsoever to do this. It was nothing but greed greed greed greed and greed."<BR/><BR/>Of course it's greed greed greed and greed. Even the man who is so fondly remembered for "ask what you can do for your country" had this to say when asked why he was running for president: "That's where power is!" --- JFK. "Public service motivation"? No, service by high-price hookers at public expense is more like it. That's just human nature. Power brings out the worst in people; government intervention in the market place is a major source of power.<BR/><BR/>"crazy thing is, no matter how much evidence they are provided showing the problem is with greedy corporations criminally co-opting our government they will basically say nah nahanah can't hear you and insist it was the damn liberal social policies and those damn poor people."<BR/><BR/>You are the one not hearing: when the government is powerful, who do you think have the money to co-opt it and get to pull the levers of that powerful government machine? Of course, the wealthy individuals, not the poor. Corporation is just an artificial entity put together by a bunch of individuals, under the government law, in pursuit of profit with limited liability. Enpowering the government is as simple as giving the poor and the middle class a rope to hang themselves.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18675105.post-82294878011555269362008-03-30T19:32:00.000+01:002008-03-30T19:32:00.000+01:00"George Bush's Ownership society really means you ..."George Bush's Ownership society really means you are on your own. George always says that government is inefficient at taking care of people. Then that is not government worth having George."<BR/><BR/>There is nothing wrong with what he is saying. It's what he's been doing is the problem:<BR/><BR/>(1) If we were indeed left alone on our own, we wouldn't have a humongous homeland security bureacracy wasting money and resources snooping on people; we wouldn't have a mushrooming medicine bill robbing us.<BR/><BR/>(2) Government is indeed inefficient at taking care of people. It failed miserably in the war on poverty, and the war on drugs; that's what we get for government taking care of people in the inner cities. Now, the problem with W administration policy is that, what makes anyone think that US government intervention would be good at taking care of Iraqis?!<BR/><BR/>(3)Government is indeed not worth having. Just look at the huge boom an dbust cycles that we have been having ever since having the government taking care of our money's worth, which has now lost 98% of its worth since the FED started in 1913.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com